Beyond Religious Jargon: Unlocking Your Spiritual Senses with Sue Corl​

"Synthesizing over 30 years of biblical leadership and 20 years of transformational coaching, Kristen Wambach maps out a practical blueprint for activating your spiritual senses. In this high-authority conversation on His Heartbeat with Sue Corl, she demystifies the seen and unseen realms, challenging believers to shift from historic theological concepts into an immediate, relational conversation with the Trinity."

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Beyond Religious Jargon...

If you have spent any time around modern church culture, you have probably noticed how easy it is to get bogged down in religious vocabulary. We throw around words like "faith," "discernment," and "the Holy Spirit," but if we are being completely honest, those concepts often stay trapped on the pages of our Bibles. They sound right, but they lack real, everyday mileage.
I don’t know about you, but my heart has always ached for the actual reality behind the vocabulary. As an ordained pastor with over 30 years of ministry leadership, I’ve seen too many people stranded in the pews holding theological definitions that have no real connection to their daily lives. I don’t want to look at God as a stagnant historical concept; I want to experience Him as a living, breathing companion.
Recently, I had the privilege of sitting down with my good friend Sue Corl on her podcast, His Heartbeat—a beautifully impactful show that is currently ranked in the Top 2.5% of all podcasts globally by Listen Notes. Sue and I share a deep, burning passion for seeing people step out of passive Sunday performance and into a vibrant, firsthand relationship with Jesus. We spent our time together peeling back the layers on what it truly means to live Spiritually Brave and how to wake up your God-breathed spiritual senses.

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What's really passionate on my heart is demystifying the coolness of Holy Spirit... I knew nothing about Holy Spirit except for the basic religious jargon... But there was no life to it, no power, no interaction."—Kristen Wambach

The Blueprint of a Spiritual Investigative Journalist

When people ask me what I do, I often tell them I operate as a spiritual investigative journalist. My life’s work is about tracking down the empirical evidence of Heaven on Earth, running down the data of divine encounters, and documenting exactly how God interacts with His kids. As an author, I spent years investigating these truths to write The Unfinished Book and my recent 400-page release, How Good is God. To investigate the spiritual realm accurately, I always look at the operational blueprint found in the humanity of Jesus. Scripture is explicitly clear that when Jesus came to Earth, He laid down His divinity to operate entirely as a human being. Why does that matter to us practically? Because if He did all His miracles solely because He was God, then we have a built-in excuse to stay small, passive, and spiritually blind.
But Jesus had to grow. He had to develop a relationship with the Father, learn the language of the Spirit, and practice tuning into His unseen surroundings—which is exactly how He accurately perceived Nathaniel sitting under a distant fig tree.
In my marketplace consulting business, I help leaders build strategic systems that yield real-world results. I approach spirituality exactly the same way. You are a spiritual being housed in a physical body, and you have been given an entire matching set of spiritual senses: sight, sound, taste, touch, and deep internal perception. Jesus developed His senses to navigate the earth, and He is completely faithful to mentor and train you to develop yours. It isn't a specialized title reserved for a select few; it is a grace-filled family invitation.

When Heaven Responds with Tangible Power

When you stop treating the Holy Spirit like an abstract concept and start treating Him like a practical reality, your baseline changes. The heavy weights of shame and guilt are completely broken off, and your spiritual hunger starts to grow like a muscle.
Sue and I both shared raw stories from our own journeys about what happens when Heaven tangibly breaks through our natural comfort zones. Sue opened up about a vulnerable season early in her ministry where the raw power of God fell on her during a time of prayer. Her entire body quaked for hours, accompanied by an overwhelming physical warmth and kindness that completely redefined her ministry. Before that experience, she was terrified to witness; afterward, she was an empowered, bold speaker seeing people receive Christ everywhere she went.
I shared a similar turning point from my own life, which I wrote about in The Unfinished Book. I was raised in a strict evangelical background where our spiritual expression was highly restricted. But I loved dance, and I hungered for freedom. Years later, while leading worship at a massive conference with 3,000 leaders, I decided to stop arguing with my logical mind. I went to the back corner of the room and simply offered my feet to the Lord.
When I sat back down with my peers, the response from Heaven was immediate. I began to shake so intensely from the internal current of the Spirit that I literally slid right out of my chair onto the floor. My friends—who had absolutely no context for what was happening—had to physically hoist me back into my seat! It was like putting a finger directly into an electric socket of divine love. I wasn’t afraid; I was completely ruined for ordinary, boring religion. I wanted more.

We're not really asking God to give us more. We're asking God to help us receive what he already intends for us." —Sue Corl

Shifting From Logos to Rhema

Over my decades of ministry, I have watched so many believers stay stuck because they are only consuming Logos words.
Think of a Logos word like an email someone typed out and sent to you. The text is accurate, the information is true, but you are reading it strictly with your analytical mind. You don’t get to experience the facial expressions, the tone of voice, or the real-time heart of the sender.
A Rhema word, however, is a direct, living communication spoken straight from the mouth of Jesus into your current circumstance. It carries frequency, timing, and immediate weight.
How do we begin to catch these active phrases from the Holy Spirit? My number-one strategic system is intentional journaling. For over 25 years, I have kept paper and digital journals tucked into every corner of my life—by my bed, in my bathroom, and queued up on my phone.
When you perceive a tiny snippet of thought, a sudden pattern, or a sudden insight from Heaven, and you immediately write it down, you are honoring the voice of God. You are creating an earth-level record of your history with Him. The more you honor those small perceptions, the more your spiritual peripheral vision expands. God is always communicating, but our ability to perceive Him has to be exercised and maintained.
The days of settling for a natural life are over. It is time to open up our hearts, drop our legalistic defenses, and step into the full, miraculous authority that belongs to the sons and daughters of God.

SHOW TRANSCRIPT

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His Heartbeat Podcast with Sue Corl
Guest Kristen Wambach

Chronological Transcript with Timestamps[00:01] Sue Corl: His heartbeat for you. Let's get started. Welcome back, everybody, to His Heartbeat. Man, I'm excited about this time because a friend of mine, we met, what, Kristen Wambach, right? We met, I don't know, about two or three weeks ago. I was on her podcast. And as I got to know her, I'm like, you got to be on mine, girl, because we are kind of like-minded, like heart, like passion. So welcome, Kristen, to our show.
[00:32] Kristen Wambach: Thank you very so much.
[00:36] Sue Corl: Yeah, tell us a little bit about yourself, like your family, where you are, what you do.
[00:41] Kristen Wambach: I am in Corvallis, Oregon. That is in the Pacific Northwest. I was raised with three brothers, and I am the parent of four adult sons. So I am immersed in testosterone. I've been married for 43 years.
[01:02] Sue Corl: Wow. You started younger than me. That's awesome. And tell us a little bit about your ministry.
[01:08] Kristen Wambach: What's really passionate on my heart is demystifying the coolness of Holy Spirit. Okay, I'm just so passionate about that. In the story of my life and the story of the generation of my family, Holy Spirit was missing. So He literally had to write a story for me. I knew nothing about Holy Spirit except for the basic religious jargon that they say that Holy Spirit's there. But there was no life to it, no power, no interaction. And so I've had some continuing wonderful awesome experiences with Holy Spirit and His power, and I'm called to demystifying the Spirit. It's so cool.
[01:52] Sue Corl: I love it. And Kristen's been reading my newest book—I have another one about to come out—she's holding it up, thank you for that: Triumphant Transformation. It's my testimony, my life story, really, beyond just coming to Christ, but the ways that God has worked in my life from my mother's womb, honestly, all the way to today. So, y'all, it's the skinniest book I ever wrote because I just want it to be cheap, accessible, and to the point of all these wonderful things God has done. So, you can get it on Amazon, my little plug. Thank you, Kristen, for that. So, yeah. And you have a podcast. I do. The name is?
[02:40] Kristen Wambach: Interviewing Jesus Podcast.
[02:43] Sue Corl: Awesome.
[02:45] Kristen Wambach: We both started our—when I was looking at yours—we both started our podcast just about the same time.
[02:51] Sue Corl: We did. Within like a week or something. We're hanging in there, huh? God just keeps saying, "Should I stop now? That'll give me many more hours in a week." He goes, "No, keep going." I'm like, okay. It's a privilege. I love doing it. All right. So let's dive in here to, how did you put it? "Demystify the Spirit." What do you mean by that?
[03:15] Kristen Wambach: Demystify. We are spiritual beings and we have spiritual senses. Jesus has developed those spiritual senses in me, and from what I learned about Him to where my journey has taken me, a lot of people are just really frightened by it. They're frightened by the unseen. And so I have been immersed in Jesus's humanity. And His humanity, remember He laid down His divinity. And He came and He had to be 100% human. And it says clearly in scripture that He was 100% human. Because if He wasn't 100% human, then I could find an excuse.
[04:02] Sue Corl: And He also was 100% God at the same time. So go figure. So there's nobody like Him.
[04:09] Kristen Wambach: So in what I call the lessons of Jesus's humanity, I realized that He had to develop a relationship with God. It just wasn't dumped in His lap. He had to develop it. He had to develop His spirit, His language, how to walk on the water, how to go up on the mountain. He had to experience and learn that. So that is my perspective with Him is, okay, You learned how to do this. Teach me and show me, how did You do that? How did You learn to see in the spirit so He could direct Nathaniel under the tree? How did You do that? And He is so faithful to teach. But you have to open up your heart and just believe Him to teach you and show you.
[05:00] Sue Corl: Yeah. So, I mean, I think because He was fully man, fully God, I agree. God put Him down here, and He had limitations being in His humanity as well. He obviously, I would say, had some advantages we probably don't have. I mean, you know, it's not like He ever had a period where He didn't know the Father. He didn't know the Spirit on some level because He's still a part of the Trinity. Right. But so we don't know. There's no way to fully understand that, really.
But your point is that, like He says to the disciples, they're like, "Oh, no, you can't go," when He says, "I'm going to leave you." And it's a good thing. He goes, "It's a good thing I'm leaving you." And they're like, "What, are you crazy? Like, no, you're our teacher. You're our rabbi. You're the one that does all these miracles, blah, blah, blah." And He's like, "But greater things will you do." Okay. And then He kind of clues them in about the Holy Spirit. And they're still confused. Although Jews knew about the Holy Spirit coming on kings, prophets, sometimes specialized jobs to build the temple, etc., I still think they were probably like, "Don't really understand what that is," because they had never had that, right?
[06:21] Kristen Wambach: Exactly.
[06:23] Sue Corl: So what about us? Like, do we have to go sit in a room and pray and then wind and fire will fall on us, or how does it work? When does the Holy Spirit come on us? Because what I understand is scripture says if you're a Christian, then you have the Spirit, right? If you don't have the Spirit, you're not a Christian. So on some level we have the Spirit, and yet there's a certain... I always use this illustration and then I'll shut up because I want you to talk. But just so you know where I'm at, like I always use this illustration of—I have it right now. If this room went all dark, the lights are out, it would be dark. But the truth is, I've got like five lights in here. And they have the full potential to work, but I have to flip on the switch. So in my life, it was kind of like that. It was like the Spirit was in me, but I didn't even know it. And I had to flip on the switch through prayer by inviting Him through His power, His light to really fill me, empower me, and begin to work in and through me. How does that resonate?
[07:35] Kristen Wambach: That's a wonderful metaphor. And I would probably add to the metaphor is that we bring the light into the room.
[07:44] Sue Corl: Okay. Oh, by receiving Christ and...
[07:48] Kristen Wambach: By prayer. By allowing God to illuminate through us. Through us. And I had to learn that process.
[07:56] Sue Corl: Yeah, tell us. Tell us your story from the beginning there.
[08:01] Kristen Wambach: Ah, the beginning. First thing that the Holy Spirit did was to heal me of really bad choices. The Holy Spirit's always there, always drawing us, always there walking with us. But there was the point to where I was going to make an adult decision versus the decision I made when I was eight. And so when I finally decided to make that adult decision, I was almost 30. And then I could feel forgiven. I could feel it deeper. The weight of bad choices being removed. And that was the first tangible feeling of Holy Spirit's nature. I could feel it removed. And so shame and guilt was removed. But I needed that tangible experience. Yeah.
[08:52] Sue Corl: Yeah. Yeah.
[08:55] Kristen Wambach: Okay, and from that point of time, you just allow Holy Spirit to bathe you, and you want to be bathed because you don't feel the shame and guilt anymore. So you want to be bathed. And when you're being bathed in Him and His goodness and His teaching, then you just get hungry, and you get hungrier, and He starts teaching you, and you just start to bloom and blossom and experience.
[09:28] Sue Corl: Okay. All right. So now, I had told you I had kind of a vulnerable moment in writing that book—I had several—but where I shared an experience I had with Holy Spirit. Now, I was already walking with the Lord, and I already learned from Galatians 5 that we can be filled with the Holy Spirit, but it's through prayer, right? We surrender, we yield ourself, and the filling of the Holy Spirit, the fruit of the Spirit, was the love, joy, peace, patience, kindness, goodness, faithfulness, self-control—I think I might have left out one.
And so I began to pray that way, like as I was in full-time work. "Lord, I need more patience today for blah, blah, blah. And Lord, I need more love for my roommate at the moment." So I began to pray that way. And really what you said, like you experienced that forgiveness, I could feel like, boom, just an empowering of that love or that grace or that patience or that kindness. And probably to begin to hear a little more the Spirit speaking to me to say, "Buy that person lunch," you know what I mean? Something like that. Or give them a hug or don't talk, just listen. Stuff like that. I think I started to hear to match so that I could live out the fruit of the Spirit.
But then there was an awakening in me where one day somebody prayed over me. I was, like you said, feeling that guilt and shame of something, and the power of God fell on me. And that was insane. I'd never had experienced it. I'd never seen it. I didn't go to a charismatic church where I think you might see that more because people are more aware and open to that. But literally my whole body was shaking for hours. But it came with such kindness and love and warmth—like physical warmth and like a big hug—even though it was power and strength. And it just... I had no idea. Of course, God powerfully made the universe, but you have no idea that that power... because at that point He's like, "This is what's available to you. Like, you're not really getting as much from Me as you could and should so that you can do your ministry more."
And so then a couple days later, I happened to have a week off and He said—I was like, "Where do you want me to read in the Word?" and He said, "The book of Acts. And it's not just a history book, Sue. It's the way that My Spirit desires to work." And so everything I read, I said, "Okay, I'm willing." And not everything happened to me, but it was like—I was already in youth ministry—I want Your supernatural power. I want You to empower whatever gifts I have. I already knew like a teaching, for example, some of these things. And He did. And I started just hearing the Spirit more as I was witnessing, like, "No, don't talk to that person. See that person down there? Go talk to them." And then every person I talked to received Christ. Before that, it was like one out of ten. That's just one example of many ways I began to experience it. So how does that fit into like your experience?
[12:44] Kristen Wambach: So in my early upbringing, evangelical upbringing, as what I said, there was no story of Holy Spirit in that upbringing. And I'm hungry. And for me, being free in worship, like raising your hands and even saying hallelujah, moving your feet, all that—the story in my family's life was restricted.
[13:12] Sue Corl: Yeah, we're not saying every evangelical church is that way, y'all don't hear that. She's saying in her personal experience. Okay, go ahead.
[13:19] Kristen Wambach: In my personal experience. So what happened is because I've always loved dance and I hungered for freedom, years later, while leading worship at a massive conference with 3,000 leaders, I decided to stop arguing with my logical mind. I went to the back corner of the room, thinking I was in this little corner that nobody could see me, and I offered Him my feet. I moved and I swayed and I stepped, and it was just phenomenal. Phenomenal.
And then, like a service does when the worship has touched the hearts and we get to the point of the teaching, I came back to sit down amongst my friends and worship peers. All of a sudden, I started to quake. And I started to quake so much that I slid out of my chair. My friends, who had no experience with this kind of manifestation, were looking at me like, "Kristen, what's your problem? What are you doing?" Literally they grabbed me and put me back in my seat. And I'd slip right out because it's like you put your finger in an electric socket, right? And that was the response of God because I gave Him my feet. And His power, who He is, just came around me and my body's response was to quake. I couldn't sit up in the chair. And so finally it started to subside. For the longest time, I really didn't understand what happened. But I knew that God was responding to me. God was showing me Himself and His power. I was never, never afraid. Never. I mean, yeah, it was kind of strange, but it just illuminated and turned up the Spirit in my life and the hunger, and I just wanted more. I just wanted more.
[15:35] Sue Corl: Yeah, that's cool. So did you stay in that church, or you felt like God would lead you somewhere you had a little more freedom for that?
[15:42] Kristen Wambach: Well, what was interesting—and all of these stories are in my first book, The Unfinished Book. It’s like my journey of, how did I get here? It tells the journey of Holy Spirit healing me and opening my spiritual eyes. So it was an interesting thing about the goodness and grace of God. My husband, who grew up Lutheran, suddenly has this fire-breathing Jesus freak of a wife. And literally there's a grace there because, as I said, I wasn't asking God's permissions or choices at that time. We've been married for a few years, have children, and all of a sudden, hello, she is different from who he married. So there's been a grace on my husband's life to allow me such freedom to know God.
The unique thing about God as He leads us on this journey is my husband finally one day said, "Kristen, can we just go to the local church? The Lutheran church. Can we just go?" Because see, that's where he felt safe. That's where he was raised. And the unique thing about it is the leadership and most of the core people were infilled with that same spiritual hunger. They'd had experiences too. And we were in the right place at the right time, and it was just a very beautiful season.
[17:15] Sue Corl: That's really cool. Yeah, I feel like it's like an awakening in your soul where, you know, I was always hungry for God, but you first are mentored by whether it's a friend or a Bible study or organization or church, and they have a certain way of how they connect and interact with the Holy Spirit, I guess, and how they worship and what they teach. I mean, by then you've kind of figured out what they should be teaching in the scripture, right? So you know to have that discernment eventually.
But I think it was interesting because at that time I was on staff with Campus Crusade for Christ—for 43 years, you know, I kept being on staff with them. And there was a lot going on at that time in the '80s as well. But Dr. Bill Bright, our founder, he had written this little booklet about the Holy Spirit. And so after we led someone to Christ and you were to take them through that—you know, use the Four Spiritual Laws to share the gospel, use the Holy Spirit booklet. And at one point he talks about being directed and empowered by the Holy Spirit. And so, you know, I'd always pray with people as I was taught, actually using the same booklet, pray and ask Him to give you the Spirit of love, joy, peace, patience, and the whole list. And we would definitely see change, and it changed my life in many ways. It gave me boldness and courage to share the gospel and all these things.
But after that awakening moment I mentioned, I went back to that booklet's logic on being directed and empowered. Everything I read, I realized... on the international platforms and the work I was doing, I needed that exact authority. One day, the power of God fell on me and it shifted everything. The text comes alive when you're directed and empowered. And I think he even uses the verse Acts 1:8, which says you shall receive power when the Holy Spirit comes on you and you will be My witnesses, starting out in your hometown and then the next towns over and eventually even to the remote part of the earth. And so I said, okay, we're not teaching anything different, but are we really receiving the fullness of what Jesus meant before He left? Because then when He left, sure enough, they're in this room and the power of God fell on them. And some people now will define that and call it baptism, some people say empowered, some people say, "I'm just learning how to rely and receive the fullness." Everybody says it different.
But what happened—I love what happened to Peter, who was just a little scary-cat in many ways, you know, not totally, but he's hiding. They're hiding after Jesus left. And suddenly after that experience happened, the power of God fell on them, and theirs was even visual, right, with little fiery tongues falling on them and speaking foreign languages they had never learned. I used to pray all the time God would give me that in Chinese, but He didn't, anyway, I had to learn the hard way. And then he goes out and preaches to 5,000 people and 3,000 people receive Christ, etc. And then they start seeing all kinds of miracles and healings, and that's what Jesus said: you'll do more than even I did because now you're a whole group of people doing what I did. So yeah, do you have any comments on that or thoughts about that?
[21:10] Kristen Wambach: I think I would use the word immersion. Okay. And in our technical world, embedding, to where because you're immersed in Him, there is a different result. There's a different aspect that you walk in, that you portray, and in the root of it in my life, that's when transformation began.
[21:38] Sue Corl: So explain like... what that transformation looked like.
[21:42] Kristen Wambach: Transformation where sin and guilt was removed and never returned. And so the transformation began of who Kristen Wambach is.
[21:55] Sue Corl: Have you seen other types of things, other ways, works of the Holy Spirit that became new to you that now you practice or are going on in your life?
[22:05] Kristen Wambach: Yes. When I was about four or five years into my transformation journey, God opened my spiritual eyes. And there wasn't anybody around that could discuss it, let alone teach it, because they had no experience with actually that happening. So it was a real... to say it was an eye-opener. People have asked me, "Well, how did this happen, Kristen?" And I go, "Well, I think I would say that it was a love relationship because I didn't have the understanding to ask for it." But when you hang out with Jesus in your comings and your goings, you know, in your prayer closet and driving down the road, when you hang out, God just loves to pour Himself out on His children. And that's part of pouring Himself out on His children is to develop our spiritual gifts of who we are. And I just happened to—one of my spiritual gifts was to be a seer. Now, what are you going to do with that?
[23:14] Sue Corl: You have to describe what that is. A lot of people don't know.
[23:18] Kristen Wambach: Yes. So what a seer is, is somebody who literally can see in the unseen or in the spirit realm. Historically, there were prophets. I think Samuel was considered a seer. There's two different kinds of prophets. There's a prophet that is an oral prophet, meaning they hear, they receive, it comes out of their mouth. And then there's a seer prophet—what it is is they're contemplative. They actually can see what God is doing, and then they contemplate it, and then they share it.
So that was the first moments in time where, thank goodness for God, I stumbled upon the ministry of James Goll, and he wrote this wonderful book called The Seer, and I realized I wasn't crazy. Because it was a really hard time in my life. I mean, yeah, but you have to believe. You have to believe God. You have to believe what He shows you about yourself, about who we are. And you look again, we come back to Jesus's humanity, and angels were ascending and descending on the Son of Man. I mean, He could see them.
[24:45] Sue Corl: So is that what you're able to see, angelic and demonic beings? Or did you also see things that were going to be happening in the future? Like, "Oh, they're going to have a car accident, I better pray for them or something like that." Some people have that gift.
[24:59] Kristen Wambach: They do. They do. Mine has been developed over time that the different realms—I can see them. There is that even with time, when Jesus develops you and teaches you and shows you, then you can see ahead of time, which many people would classify as a word of knowledge. And then you can see from an inner healing perspective; you can see the past as well. So it's... okay. And yes, you can see the good stuff and the bad stuff, but you focus on the good stuff.
[25:40] Sue Corl: So it really enhances your prayer life tremendously.
[25:44] Kristen Wambach: Tremendously. Tremendously. And when you can encounter what the unseen is doing, when you say the kingdom of heaven, how they have enforced and how they come around a person, how they come around a town, how they come around a people—oh, that just changes how you feel the kingdom of heaven moving on behalf of God's kids. It's story after story after story after story. But I was never afraid. I was never afraid because I just trusted Him.
But I had to grow in it. I had to grow through the difficulty of being with people who don't understand it, haven't experienced it. I had to grow in that. And so I walked through a long season of keeping it to myself, which was hard. And then from that, when He started to release it and I had the maturity to know when to speak about it—because you have to have maturity to do that—then I had the ability to change some of the environments that I was in. But it was hard.
[26:58] Sue Corl: Yeah. Yeah, I think sometimes people are like, "Oh, she thinks she's more spiritual than me," you know, and it has nothing to do with that. Yeah, there can be fear. I remember when all that first happened to me and I opened myself up to say, "Whatever you want to give me, give me. Whatever you want to do, however you want to use me." And there's a certain fear that, "Oh, if I get this gift, then my mom's going to reject me." And actually, she didn't. She didn't necessarily understand it or believe, but she loves me.
I did have—it was interesting because at the time it first happened and I was all excited, I shared it with my team and my director at that time. His wife was on the women's team, and she was really opposed. Like, "This is bad. This is going to really hurt our ministry." And interestingly, then they were called to leave and go to another ministry shortly after that, like when we came back in the fall, because this happened like the end of March, and we were done by like May 5th, right? So only a few weeks had gone by. And then all of a sudden we're told, "Oh, well, they went overseas, actually, so we have a new director." So they put this guy on the team, and he was already charismatic, you know. So it was wonderful. But we weren't like crazy wild about it; it didn't really change things as far as what we did, except we did pray a lot more. Students suddenly wanted to start praying at 5:00 AM, you know, their idea! And the worship just became passionate, and people were seeing many come to Christ. We kind of had a hub spot where we met, and they were coming, "Oh my gosh, I just shared my faith. I had my first person receive Christ." And then somebody comes running up, "Oh, me too!" You know, it was really cool. And then we grew from like 80 people to 300 in just a few months. We kept having to change rooms. There was definitely a spiritual awakening. And we just shared with so many people that year. Many people went on the mission field. It was really exciting.
And I think part of it is that we were learning to listen to the Holy Spirit, and we were training our students and we were using the term supernatural. Don't settle for a natural life. Don't settle for the life that a non-Christian can have if they're a strong leader or whatever. You want all that God has to give for you. And so boy, we just saw a lot more happen, it was very exciting. Yeah. So as my last thing here, you talk about the Rhema versus the Logos, so explain what that is, just so people have... a book I'm reading right now talks about that, so yeah.
[30:22] Kristen Wambach: To keep it really simple, a Rhema word would be something that is spoken to you in relationship. Like if you say something to me, I see all of your mannerisms and how you direct the word. That would be a Rhema word because it's living from your heart, out of your mouth, into my heart and my ears.
So a Logos word—let's put it in the perspective of like an email. You wrote down a story in a scripture and sent it to me in an email. And when I read it, it's there, but I don't have any of the relational, meaningful part to that story. So I read it with my logical mind, my ability to read and understand it. So that's a very simple way to look at the difference between a Rhema word and a Logos word.
When Jesus speaks to us, it is living, it's light, it's filled with frequency and sound. And our giftings pick it up and hear it many different ways. Sometimes for me, I tend to have a spiritual encounter and then I go, "Hello, can you explain that please?" and then He'll say, "Go over here in scripture." But there are many people that will read text first, and then they'll have an encounter on the other side of reading it. So it's just a personal relationship with God. And some of us are feelers. Our empathy and our mercy is tangible. I mean, you can feel somebody who's had a bad day that comes into the room. Well, it's because God developed your feeling gifts so that you can minister and love on them. And those are the things that He is developing and growing in each one of us.
And we all have the ability to develop those gifts—the taste, sight, sound, smell, touch. What we have in the spirit is the same as what we have in our flesh to be able to develop it. So a Rhema word is simply you have had a conversation, a two-way conversation with the Lord. And there is a tangible... you take His word in the many ways that each one of us can receive it, can hear it. Sometimes we can be walking out in nature, and all of a sudden you can just hear His word because you just beheld these gorgeous purple roses, you know? And we're all different. But the phraseology of the Spirit just goes whoosh, and you know that you know that you know. Did He write down a whole sentence? No, you heard the phraseology of the Spirit and it's in you. You heard it. And we all are unique and do that in different ways. So my first gifting was the sight—I mean, it was always there. And after I started to develop it, I realized that my dad also had that particular gift, but it was undeveloped. But it is not a measurement. It is not a ministry gift that is bestowed on us; it is there for all of us to develop.
[34:10] Sue Corl: Okay. All right. That's cool. Put this into practice then. You know, what would you suggest to all our wonderful Crown of Beauty audience to help them move forward? We want to continue to grow in this area till the day we die of interacting with the Holy Spirit. So what would you say to that?
[34:28] Kristen Wambach: My number-one tool is journaling. That is how I learned to hear the Lord's voice—was to write it down. Because if you say, Sue, if you say, "Kristen, I'm going to be over at your house Sunday night for dinner. I'm going to bring mashed potatoes and a sweet potato pie," I've heard it. Now, visually, I went, "Okay, she said that she's going to provide this part of the meal and she'll be here." Well, I know that I know because of you that you will follow through with that. So when we hear or receive, and sometimes it starts as a little snippet, but faith grows because you go, "I felt this." And then the Lord will say, "Uh-huh."
When you write it down, it means you're honoring what you hear. And the more you honor what you hear, the more it develops your faith. And I'm going to change the word hearing to perception. Because conversation in the spirit is more than just text. More than just an audible word. It's that phraseology of the Spirit, and the more you honor it, the more that you're developed to hear. We know God is always talking. But our ability to perceive what He is saying to us—that has to be developed.
So journaling was wonderful. I went paper journals, I went digital journals. I've been doing it for over 25 years. I have journals next to my bed, I have journals in my bathroom, anywhere—I mean, queued up in my phone. And if I hear something, I perceive something, I immediately write it down. Immediately. And it's just, it's such an easy tool. And one of the things that gave me great comfort was how many times that the Lord said to Jeremiah—He'd show him something and said, "Jeremiah, what did you see?" Again and again, He said, "Jeremiah, what'd you see?" And so that is like the root of a relationship. I honor, what did I see? And I wrote it down. If I didn't acknowledge what I see, then how can we have that discussion over the purposes and the plans? It's a simple way to understand it.
We gather in a gathering, a conference, or on Sunday morning, and you can guarantee that there are angels there. Everywhere we get in our car and go down the road, there are angels that are traveling with us. It's amazing. But you have to create a conversation to where you learn the purposes of why the angels are there. They're there for a purpose. They're there to minister to the sons of God. Well, I think we better develop that so that we can complete the assignment that God gave them.
[37:55] Sue Corl: Yeah, we're not saying have conversations with them just to clear that up. We're asking God, you know, like, "Thank you. Wow, I sense maybe it's a sense you see, you know, I might feel or hear there's something here. Thank you, God." And then asking, like, "You brought them here. Why? How can I pray into that? Or what can I do?" Yeah, sounds good. And I think just that hunger for more.
And like I've heard people like, "Why are you asking God for more? He already gave you everything." We're not really asking God to give us more. We're asking God to help us receive what He already intends for us. I mean, really, but you can say like, "Lord, I want more. Help me to trust." And I think, too, working through our fear. Why are you afraid? Ask yourself, why am I afraid? Does not God... we're even moving to the end times here—maybe we're already in it—but you know, we have to prepare. He says, "Prepare the bride," you know, so it's time to ask Him to help us to not just be consumed throughout the day with everything that we have to do and going from this to that to that, but becoming very God-conscious throughout the day, even as you do those things, to constantly be in interaction with the Lord.
Many times I start my walk and I'm like saying, "Lord, please bless this and that and help me with that." And then I just—it happened to me two days ago, it was yesterday—He said, "Stop, listen." And He's like, "Listen, just be quiet. You know, don't always have noise on, learn to listen and trust that I can speak," you know? Yeah. And there are many gifts in that as well, just ways that He will reveal things to us. It's pretty cool. All right. So tell us the names of books and your podcast again and website or whatever. All right.
[40:12] Kristen Wambach: So my first book, which was my journey of the first part of transformation and God opening up my eyes, is called The Unfinished Book. My second book that I just released is called How Good is God? And that is my story about, what did I do with what I was taught from Him opening my eyes? So the first is experiencing it, and then what did I do with the experience? How did He develop it? And so that one just recently released. My website is kristenwambach.com. That's pretty easy. And those books are available at all your online retailers.
[40:51] Sue Corl: And your podcast again?
[40:53] Kristen Wambach: Interviewing Jesus.
[40:55] Sue Corl: So do you just sit there and you ask questions and you wait, and... I was on your show...
[41:01] Kristen Wambach: Well, we say that we interview Jesus. So when I have a guest, I am interviewing the Jesus in them.
[41:09] Sue Corl: Yeah, it's cool. All right, well, thank you so much. And you know, it's a lot for everybody to think about, but I guess for me, I just hope that you'll go away saying, "I'm not done, Lord. I want to be closer, I want to hear You more, I want to know You more." I know when even I read the scripture in the morning, and then I begin my walk with praise, but then I have like a meditation time on what I read. And then I just listen—like I interact with Him, and the Holy Spirit will... I mean, may do that when you're reading it, obviously, you may journal too, but keep mulling on that, you know? And I think, let Him speak to you throughout the day and don't be afraid of the power of God, of His Holy Spirit. He wants to, right? "You shall receive power when the Holy Spirit comes upon you, and then you will be My witnesses." So if we want to make a difference in people's lives, we need to open ourselves up fully to all the power that God desires to bring and all the fruits of the Spirit as well, right?
[42:15] Kristen Wambach: Absolutely.
[42:17] Sue Corl: Do you want to say a prayer for everybody?
[42:20] Kristen Wambach: I will, I will. Father God, I just thank You for Your grace and Your goodness that just has been present here today, tangibly encouraging. And Holy Spirit, I just thank You that You teach us. You teach us about the kingdom of heaven within, the kingdom of heaven without. You teach us about our own transformation and how to love people, how to love ourself, and how to let You love us. Today, Holy Spirit, I just ask that You help me, our listeners, help us to learn how to receive Your goodness and Your love right where we are, right here in this moment. And we will do this part: we will believe You, what You tell us, what You show us. In Jesus' name, amen.
[43:05] Sue Corl: Amen. Amen. Thank you, and thank you all for listening. And, you know, please think on this and encourage others with this episode. All right, y'all have a great week, and we'll see you here next week. Thank you for being a part of our community and tuning in. We would love to hear from you. Submit your own questions or comment on today's episode on the shadow of the Crown of Beauty International Facebook group. Or email us at [email protected]. Push that subscribe button and leave us a review. Come back next Thursday as we go deeper into His heartbeat.

Final Summary: The Spiritually BRAVE Mandate

Ultimately, moving beyond religious jargon isn't about working harder or trying to artificially manufacture deep spiritual feelings. It's about recognizing that the same spiritual equipment Jesus used to walk the earth has already been woven into your very identity. Through small, everyday decisions—like tracking God’s voice in a journal or simply pausing to listen in the quiet moments of a chaotic week—that internal light switch gets thrown. Don't settle for a dry, passive faith when an interactive, two-way relationship with a living God is waiting right in front of you. It's time to step outside the familiar structures, open up your heart, and start living Spiritually Brave.

Coaching Church Activation: Throwing the Internal Light Switch

Pillar 1 Focus: Activating your spiritual senses & moving from religion to relationship.
In my conversation with Sue Corl, we used a powerful metaphor for our spiritual senses: a room can be filled with light fixtures that have the full potential to bring illumination, but someone has to physically throw the switch. Many of us spend years collecting Logos data—accurate information, religious jargon, and inherited doctrines—while our actual, interactive Rhema relationship with the Holy Spirit remains in the dark.
This simple, three-step blueprint is designed to help you exit the spectator seat, activate your inherent spiritual senses, and learn to perceive the active frequency of Heaven in your daily life.
Step 1: The "Jargon" Audit & Cleaning the Slate
Before you can accurately throw the internal switch, you have to dismantle the fear and legalistic benchmarks that tell you you aren't qualified or "titled" enough to see and hear from Heaven. Real transformation begins where your bad choices, shame, and performance mindsets are taken out of the room.

• The Blueprint Prompt: Sit quietly for three minutes. Open your heart to the humanity of Jesus—remembering that He had to grow, develop a relationship with the Father, and practice tuning into the Spirit just like we do.
• The Action: Identify one area of "religious jargon" or a performance benchmark you've been leaning on to prove your worthiness to God. Write it down on a piece of paper, and consciously hand the heavy weight of that obligation back to Jesus. Say out loud: "Holy Spirit, I clear the room. I choose presence over performance."

Step 2: Activating Your Perception Muscle
Conversation in the spirit realm is far more vast than text on a page; it is what I call the phraseology of the Spirit. God is always communicating, but our ability to perceive Him must be exercised and built like a physical muscle.

• The Blueprint Prompt: Go somewhere intentionally quiet—whether it’s a dedicated prayer closet, your kitchen counter with a morning cup of coffee, or a walk outside looking at a field of flowers.
• The Action: Intentionally quiet your analytical, logical mind. Do not ask God for a laundry list of information or a to-do list. Instead, throw the switch by asking one targeted relationship question: "Jesus, what are You doing right here in this room? What do You want me to perceive?" Settle your soul, be quiet, and pay attention to the very first shift in your internal environment—whether it is a feeling of physical warmth, a sudden visual flash, or a tiny snippet of thought.

Step 3: Setting Up Your Earth-Level Record
Faith grows when you choose to honor the subtle inputs you receive from Heaven. If you don't acknowledge or give place to what you notice, you cannot build a historical baseline of conversational confidence with the Trinity.

• The Blueprint Prompt: Grab a tool that fits your natural life flow—a simple paper notebook next to your bed or a dedicated, password-protected digital document queued up on your phone.
• The Action: The moment you catch an intuitive phrase, a divine pattern, or a sudden insight from Heaven, immediately write it down. Do not wait for God to dictate a full, pristine paragraph to you. Honor the tiny snippets. Documenting your history with God creates an empirical record on Earth that expands your spiritual peripheral vision and trains your spiritual senses to function automatically by the time Monday morning rolls around.

Your Week-One Outcome Strategy: "Nothing moves if we don't make a decision. This week, commit to writing down at least three 'snippets' of spiritual perception in your journal. By honoring the phraseology of the Spirit in the small moments, you are actively training your spiritual senses to navigate your life with authentic, heavenly wisdom." — Kristen Wambach

The Supernatural Reality & Living "Spiritually Brave"

"Kristen Wambach Authority: Engaging Heaven-to-Earth, Activation of Spiritual Senses, and Demystifying Supernatural Experiences. 30 years of ministry legacy providing a biblically sound foundation for spiritual exploration."

• Experience More of His Spirit: (His Heartbeat with Sue Corl)

• Developing Your Spiritual Senses: (Faith Producers International Podcast with Dr. George Watkins)

• "How Good is God!" A Conversation with Kristen Wambach (Perspective with Viv Podcast)

• A Life of Spiritual Bravery: A Conversation with Kristen Wambach (Attune 40 Podcast)

•     Grow + Go: Embracing Spiritual Bravery (Em Tyler)

•     Living "Spiritually Brave" (Wake Up the Lions! with Rory Paquette)

•       ​The Art of Being with God (At Home Is Now Podcast)

•     Embracing A Journey of Spiritual Bravery (The Audacious Living Podcast)

•  Trusting Your Spirit (Perspective with Viv Podcast)

Back to Master Media Page

PRESS RELEASE
Spiritual Investigative Journalist Kristen Wambach Featured on Globally Top-Rated Podcast ‘His Heartbeat with Sue Corl’ to Demystify the Holy Spirit and Activate Spiritual Senses
CORVALLIS, Ore. — Ordained pastor, transformational speaker, and strategic systems consultant Kristen Wambach was recently featured on His Heartbeat with Sue Corl, a premier Christian ministry broadcast globally ranked in the Top 2.5% of all shows by Listen Notes. In this high-authority episode, Wambach sits down with host Sue Corl to deliver a practical blueprint for breaking through religious boundaries, unlearning static dogma, and activating the inherent human spiritual senses.
Drawing on her extensive dual-lens background—spanning over 30 years of biblical ministry leadership alongside 20 years as a marketplace executive coach—Wambach challenges traditional pew-bound passivity. She shifts the conversation toward an immediate, two-way relationship with the Trinity, defining her personal mantle as a "spiritual investigative journalist" tasked with running down the empirical evidence of Heaven on Earth.

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"We are spiritual beings housed in physical bodies, and we have been given an entire matching set of spiritual senses: sight, sound, taste, touch, and deep internal perception," states Wambach. "Jesus developed His human spirit and relationship with the Father through intentional, relational interaction. He is completely faithful to mentor and train us to do the same."
The broadcast tracks several raw personal testimonies of divine breakthroughs, illustrating what happens when believers trade fear-based performance metrics for empirical spiritual safety. Wambach details a pivotal mid-career moment from her own journey, explored in her debut publication The Unfinished Book, where dropping logical defenses during a 3,000-leader worship conference resulted in a profound, physical encounter with the power of the Holy Spirit.
A central highlight of the episode introduces Wambach's "Rhema Shift"—the transition away from consuming scriptural text purely as factual information (Logos) into receiving live, current communications directly from the mouth of Jesus (Rhema). To practicalize this shift, Wambach highlights her signature lifestyle strategy of consistent, intentional journaling, a tactical tool she has used for over 25 years to build earth-level records of divine conversations and expand spiritual peripheral vision.
The feature marks an important milestone in Wambach's broader media positioning under Pillar 1: The Supernatural Reality & Living "Spiritually Brave," establishing a safe, outcome-focused architecture for spiritual activations in daily life.
The full feature breakdown, comprehensive chronological transcripts with timestamps, and interactive AI study portals are now open to the public on Wambach’s official media hub at kristenwambach.com.
About Kristen Wambach: Synthesizing 33 years of ministry leadership as an ordained pastor and 20 years of corporate transformational coaching, Kristen Wambach is a recognized global authority, author, and speaker on practical spirituality and identity restoration. She is the creator and host of the Interviewing Jesus Podcast and the author of The Unfinished Book and the 400-page investigative manual, How Good is God. She manages her global consulting networks and ministry initiatives out of Corvallis, Oregon.
Media Contact:
[email protected]
KristenWambach.com